‘Young Sherlock’ Stars Hero Fiennes Tiffin and Joseph Fiennes Crack the Case on Big Spoilers and Real Chemistry

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[Editor’s note: The following interview contains spoilers for “Young Sherlock.”]

For Hero Fiennes Tiffin, “Young Sherlock” turned out to be an unexpected family affair.

In the first season of the new Prime Video series, executive produced by swashbuckling director Guy Ritchie, Fiennes Tiffin not only gets to reinvent the origin story of the world’s most famous detective, but he also gets to go toe-to-toe on-camera with his own flesh and blood, and for the first time.

Over the course of the eight-episode first season, young Sherlock teams up with new friend and future foe James Moriarty (Dónal Finn) to unravel an international conspiracy that can be traced back to his mad scientist father, Silas, who has plans to revolutionize the future of chemical warfare. Silas is played by Fiennes Tiffin’s own maternal uncle, Joseph Fiennes.

That casting, in retrospect, felt like a stroke of genius on the part of showrunner Matthew Parkhill. “Hero obviously held Joe in such high esteem, and he was nervous. I think he really wanted Joe’s approval, and that fed into Sherlock really wanting his father’s approval,” Parkhill told IndieWire. “As the dynamic between Sherlock and Silas changes over the course of the season, so did the dynamic between Joe and Hero. The more time they worked together, the more you could feel Hero come into his own in front of his uncle, and it’s exactly what the character is doing. That wasn’t planned for.”

Fiennes, for his part, has worked with “pretty much” all of his siblings, four (of five) of whom still work in the family business. “I sneaked out of drama school to do a tiny appearance in the back of a scene with my brother Ralph on ‘A Dangerous Man’ about T.E. Lawrence,” he recalled. But Fiennes had never worked with a relative on a “really meaty” project of this scale, with “great exchanges and scenes,” until he was cast opposite his older sister Martha’s son in “Young Sherlock.”

On a joint video call from London last week, the Fiennes men — who could hardly contain their excitement about finally being allowed to discuss spoilers — opened up about their on-screen and off-screen relationships.

The following interview has been edited and condensed for clarity.

IndieWire: Your showrunner, Matthew Parkhill, was responsible for casting you to play father and son. Joseph, since Hero was already attached, did you feel any trepidation about signing on to this show?

Joseph Fiennes: I was a little bit nervous that this might be a gimmick, like, “Let’s get two people that are connected together in this way.” But that soon went out the window when [Parkhill] told me the take on this — how it was an origin story, the development of this extraordinary, gifted detective.

I’ve seen Hero’s work. I’ve seen him grow into the leading man that he is now. So I felt really comfortable working with him, but I was hoping it wasn’t something gimmicky, which it wasn’t at all. In many ways, it’s a gift that we’ve both lent into. There’s that familiarity that actors yearn for in terms of authenticity — and we get it for free.

Matthew told me that you used to do magic tricks for Hero as a kid, and those childhood memories were actually written into the script.

Joseph Fiennes: I love tricks, and it’s been a big part of my own children’s growing up. I love the misdirection and the awe and wonder when something unimaginable takes place — the disappearance of an object and then its reappearance, levitation, things like that. So Hero, sadly, poor thing was subjected to his uncle’s terrible bad dad tricks. I spoke to Matthew about this connection, and I don’t know whether it was myself or Matthew — probably Matthew, because he’s so bloody intelligent — who came up with the idea of, “Let’s work that into the script.” That’s another gift of the familiarity between Hero and I.

Hero, how did your mother react to the casting?

Hero Fiennes Tiffin: I don’t remember what her initial reaction was, but I can say with almost complete certainty that she would have just been so happy and excited. She came to the cast and crew screening. She absolutely loved it, but she hasn’t seen any of me and Joe’s work together. I’ve made her promise to me that she won’t watch it until I’m with her so that we can watch it together. I know she’d be over the moon, wouldn’t she?

Joseph Fiennes: She’d be super thrilled. It’s just joyous, nothing but joyous.

This 19-year-old, unfiltered version of Sherlock is a dramatic departure from the cold and clinical detective that most people know. Hero, given that this character has been played in so many different ways, how did you want to go about making this Sherlock your own?

Hero Fiennes Tiffin: I actually sent Henry [Cavill] a text just saying, “Having worked with Guy and played the character [in ‘Enola Holmes’], is there anything I should do to prepare myself? It’s quite daunting, but I’m really excited.” He gave me a very wise quote that was, “A man who worries before it’s necessary worries more than necessary,” which is easier said than done. But there was plenty on the page that had really mapped out this journey of where to place Sherlock, in terms of what skills he hasn’t refined yet. He’s still got this natural curiosity and insane level of intellectual capability.

We know that Moriarty and Sherlock are enemies in Conan Doyle’s works, but in this interpretation, they start as friends. Sherlock is very capable of defending himself [in the future]; he’s not in our show. But in a more general sense, I wanted to make sure that the character had the youthful positivity and enthusiasm and gave everything in the world the benefit of the doubt, as we often do when we’re young. I’m excited to continue documenting the journey of his growth, and sadly watching him lose that as he comes closer to the slightly more cynical, colder, emotionally shut off, more socially removed character who Conan Doyle created.

Joseph, on the flip side, given that Sherlock’s father has rarely been seen in the literary canon, how did you think about building Silas from the ground up as this kind of amoral scientist?

Joseph Fiennes: To invent Silas has been delicious because I’m under no pressures or preconceived notions to a degree, and that’s been really liberating. Silas’ journey is a curious one. I feel that a lot of Sherlock is about controlling and containing the situation, because there’s so much chaos growing up [in his life] — not unlike Conan Doyle, who grew up with chaos. His father was an illustrator, but also an alcoholic. So there was great imagination, but also chaos. You feel that that theme is somehow subliminally filtered down here, and Silas brings the chaos. He’s a bad man in terms of what he’s done and put his family through for his own means.

I think that he’s bruised by the fact that he can’t have the income and the financial security that his wife has imbued upon him, so he’s snatched it, thus causing this great rupture within his family. He’s criminal, but I love that Hero’s character is a misfit criminal to a degree, and it’s that mind that can work out other criminals. It’s obviously a big leap for him to get there, because emotionally he couldn’t bear the idea that his father could be who he turns out to be. I love that journey he goes on.

Matthew and Guy chose to model this new take on Holmes and Moriarty’s relationship after Paul Newman and Robert Redford’s characters in “Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid.” Hero, what do you think Holmes and Moriarty see in each other that makes them such great friends but then such formidable adversaries later in life?

Hero Fiennes Tiffin: I hadn’t seen “Butch and Sundance” until they made that reference. I feel very guilty for it, but I’ve seen it now — and what a film. Sherlock’s mom obviously states that Sherlock’s never had many friends. He’s very, very different from most people. He’s exceptional. Actually, if he was any more exceptional intellectually, then it would be hard to justify that he’s a human being. He’d have to have some supernatural powers. I think Moriarty’s the same. They’re both so exceptional, and they both identify this in each other.

I think it’s also really, really interesting that they make such a good team because where one lacks, the other one makes up for it. My dad has often told me about a quote, “If you’re the smartest in the room, you’re in the wrong room.” I think Sherlock and Moriarty want smart people around them, but they struggle to find anyone who’s as brilliant as they are intellectually. So when they find each other, they appreciate that they’re going to elevate each other, and we, as an audience, understand that they wouldn’t become as exceptional as they become if it weren’t for them having each other.

So much of the success of this show is built on that close friendship between Holmes and Moriarty. Could you tell in your chemistry read with Dónal that he was the Moriarty to your Sherlock? How did you develop that dynamic with him?

Hero Fiennes Tiffin: I feel like I did. Everyone who came in was exceptional, and I’d never been in a chemistry read where I knew that I had the role. Because I’m often in that sweaty, palm, anxious mood that you’re in in almost every audition, I really wanted to facilitate an environment where all of the actors could give it their best shot. I remember Dónal coming in towards the end of one day and me not deliberately, but just being a little bit tired and maybe complacent. I remember, within two seconds of him reading his lines, going, “Damn, this guy’s going to make me look bad, if I don’t really step up my game.” I never had a say, but I would have put a lot of money on Dónal getting the role because he was exceptional.

But in terms of developing our onscreen chemistry as Sherlock and Moriarty, we both approached it from a position of teamwork and having each other’s backs. I remember in the makeup trailer or in each other’s trailers explaining to him how I wanted to do it and him to me how he wanted to, and trying to build a synchronicity. If he has a chunk of dialogue, then I have a chunk of dialogue after. We’d often say, “Can we take four lines each of the first block of dialogue and four lines each of the next to make it really feel like we finish each other’s sentences?” There’s a musicality and rhythm [between them], and even with physicality, if something happens over here, we made sure that we both turn to look at it at the same time.

What makes Silas’ villainous turn in Episode 5 so heartbreaking is the fact that there is still a lot of genuine love between him and Sherlock. What intrigued each of you about the complexity of that relationship?

Hero Fiennes Tiffin: When Sherlock starts to identify [questionable] aspects of his father and how his mother ended up in the asylum, no amount of evidence is enough for Sherlock. He would only need so much evidence if it was unrelated [to him], but the fact it’s his father, understandably, makes it so much harder for him to accept the truth. We know Moriarty to be a villain, [but] he’s such a good friend to Sherlock when you watch our show. I was almost getting frustrated with how much proof Sherlock needed when all the arrows are pointing in the same direction.

Joseph Fiennes: Silas is a great manipulator, and that’s what’s going on. He’s manipulating with raw emotions. But I also think it’s a father, almost in the most difficult way, putting him through a series of tests and lessons. When we get to the very end, he’s passed on some information which [Sherlock] deduces, and he gets this key. What’s this key about? Maybe we’ll find that out in the future, I don’t know. He’s trying to work out which family member’s got the gifts, and he’s surprised by young Sherlock. I don’t think he’s given him the worth and the weight of his genius.

Hero Fiennes Tiffin: What’s so much fun about telling this story is we get to originate the famous quotes from Conan Doyle’s works. There’s something that Moriarty says in regards to this whole situation with Sherlock and Silas. Moriarty says to Sherlock, “When you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth.” I love how difficult it is for Sherlock to come to terms with that truth, and it was the perfect place to put that quote. It’s so satisfying for me as a Sherlock fan to now go, “Ah, that’s where Sherlock got it from. When Sherlock tells Watson, it’s because Moriarty told him.”

Matthew Parkhill met a little bit of resistance from various people when pitching the idea of that fifth episode, because it really feels like it puts the brakes on, and it’s such a different tone and pacing — and it’s pretty much everyone’s favorite episode. It’s a testament to him for really sticking his neck out and going with his guns because it’s really powerful.

This version of the Holmes family felt a little bit like a Greek tragedy, and it feels fitting that Silas was going to die at the hands of his most worthy successor. What do you remember from the process of shooting that climactic sequence on a huge cliff?

Hero Fiennes Tiffin: We shot a lot of the show out of order, so it was really nice to shoot that finale on the final day. Actually, we’re really on a cliff edge there. There were a lot of times where we needed to be clipped in harnesses, because there is a sheer drop that will kill you if you fall off. So throughout the whole show, we were lucky enough to have sets that feel so visceral and real.

Joseph Fiennes: Silas doesn’t die at the hands of young Sherlock. In fact, quite the opposite. Sherlock goes to save his father, so there’s a lovely sense of redemption and forgiveness in this last exchange. It’s Silas who grabs hold of young Sherlock to shield himself against the bullets that might come flying from Zine’s character, and he edges his way to a cliff and then lets go knowing full well what would happen — possibly his demise. In many ways, he’s always a step ahead and he’s a bit of a trickster. But there’s just this intimate exchange, and there’s an exchange of love, forgiveness, acceptance. Silas quietly, succinctly and secretly plants a piece of information in his pocket, which has great value. So the game’s still afoot.

Hero Fiennes Tiffin: Despite everything Silas has done, Sherlock still doesn’t believe in an eye for an eye. He’s got such a strong sense of a moral compass and justice. He doesn’t just want to punish him. He doesn’t want him to see death or be locked behind bars. He can’t help but believe he can be the one to persuade his father to not be a bad person.

Joseph Fiennes: That end bit is really interesting. It’s almost like [Silas] wipes the slate clean by saying, “Now,” in a sort of Christ-like act, “I’m letting go of you. I’m making the decision to fall backwards.” So it’s not like he’s been pushed, but there’s another manipulation going on. He’s manipulating their love by letting go and saying, “I always knew you loved me, my boy.”

Hero Fiennes Tiffin: There’s one more line after that as well, which is, “We are not above nature.”

Joseph Fiennes: “We are not above nature.”

Hero Fiennes Tiffin: It’s really complex. I have a parallel pain from Sherlock’s perspective where he wants to be the one to save his dad and make him better — and even then Silas still takes the power from him. Sherlock’s going to need a lot of therapy. [Joseph Fiennes laughs.] Silas really, really puts him through it. At the very, very end, if he’d made the decision to push Silas, then at least he’d—

Joseph Fiennes: Take control.

Hero Fiennes Tiffin: Exactly.

Joseph Fiennes: Silas takes the control away from him — and he’s a man that loves control.

By the end of the season, Sherlock and Moriarty realize they each have something the other wants — Moriarty has the full solution to make the deadly chemical agent that Silas was planning to sell to governments, and Sherlock has this unknown key from Silas. That feels like the first sign of a fracture in that relationship.

Hero Fiennes Tiffin: Matthew Parkhill is a genius. I don’t know how he does what he does. When I first read the script, I had to suppress this excitement to go toe-to-toe with Moriarty because I know that that’s where they’re going to end up. It takes a bit of effort to remind myself that Sherlock doesn’t know that. And, if anything, Sherlock is going to be fighting for their friendship. So I think we need to milk this cow for as long as we possibly can, but it’s so much fun to watch them as friends. It’s going to continue to fracture, and they’re going to try and glue it together as much as they can, but inevitably it’s going to break. That’s going to be painful, but enjoyable for audiences to watch.

It feels natural for members of the younger generation to want to follow their relatives into the family business, but in your case, that family business comes with a lot of public scrutiny.

Joseph Fiennes: I don’t know if it is natural for children to follow their parents’ path — some yes, some no. I think it’s a combination of being inspired by what they’ve grown up amongst, but also you feel that sometimes there can be great pushback and a need for individuals to grasp their own identity outside of their parents’ world. So when someone makes that choice, I think it’s because it lives within them; it’s not just because of the stimulus around them. There’s a need for creative expression.

How exactly would you describe your real-life relationship? Do you ever talk about work at family gatherings? Do you ever seek or give out advice?

Joseph Fiennes: I’m always there for advice, but Hero’s his own man. He’s incredibly mature. He’s been brought up by his mother who’s a filmmaker, his father who’s a filmmaker and DoP, and they have great views and thoughts on the world of creativity, and I’m sure he’s grown up with all those thoughts being shared. But when we do meet, honestly, it’s probably about football more than acting.

Hero Fiennes Tiffin: No disrespect to any other aunties or uncles, but I think he’s always probably been the coolest one. The fact that he’s the only member in my family who remotely cares about football — especially as a kid, that makes him fly up the ranks. I love Joe, but because he’s from my mom’s side of the family, and there are a lot of them and he’s a busy man, I don’t see him too much.

Ralph, Joe, and everyone else in my family would be so quick to give me advice if I ask them — and they have when I have asked them. But generally speaking, I feel so lucky and blessed to be in the position I’m in, and to have gotten my foot in the door in the first place sharing the same name as them.

I appreciate how much that’s given me, especially at the start of my career. I was very conscious of wanting to make my own mistakes and find my feet myself. I’ve asked for a lot more advice from other actors that I’ve been lucky to work with, but Joe became an actor who I worked with. So you can be sure that I picked his brain as much as I could while we were filming. [Grins.]

All episodes of “Young Sherlock” are now streaming on Prime Video.

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